What is bad about BaaN?

DarrenB · #1 20th August 2001, 16:20

Our company is thinking about implementing BaaN, we here all this good stuff about BaaN from the people trying to sell us the product what do you real users think our the bad things about it?

I'm especially interested in Manufacturing and Development issues.

Thanks.

Jason · #2 20th August 2001, 17:49

Many people say that manufacturing is considered to be the strongest part of the Baan package.
Standard cycle counting is not the greatest so it is often customised.

rcaughey · #3 20th August 2001, 19:50

I have been implementing Baan IVc3 since 1997 as a consultant after switching from SSA-BPCS implementations. Baan was much easier to use and much less buggy. Master scheduling module in Baan IVc3 is difficult but should be better in Baan V. Project control (PCS) is good but difficult to explain to clients. Other modules I found to be very deep in functionality requiring little or no customizations. I have implemented successfully MPS, MRP, SFC, PUR, SLS, INV, PCS and PCF (Product configurator) and DRP.

patvdv · #4 20th August 2001, 20:56

Baan is indeed very strong in the manufacturing department due to historical reasons. For that area it is prolly one of the best in its class.

Once you have your system up and running, get yourself a good Baan admin though. A Baan system can be resource intensive where system maintenance is concerned: OS/database management, patch management, user/printer management etc.

Nevertheless Baan is worth the $$$, otherwise this board would not exist

James · #5 20th August 2001, 22:13

There are both lots of good and bad things about Baan.

But remember that other ERP's also suffer from the same or similar problems.

The Baan software is in itself proven to be successful. Though, there are many "features" and problems.

Indeed, the Manufacturing modules in Baan are somewhat superior to other ERP's.

Problems revolving around development are inherent within all other ERP's.

My advice would be to keep the setup as simple as possible. Avoiding the use of 3rd Party Baan add-on's would be much desirable, if possible.

If the Baan Software can model your business/process model, then there should be no reason not to implement Baan. Its fast and cheap to implement/maintain.

There are many factors to be taken into consideration before you make a decision on whether to implement Baan. There are bad/negative sides, but these would be just small factors in the overall decision.

Markus B · #6 23rd August 2001, 15:52

There is nothing really bad about Baan, especially not in manufacturing. There are just very few shortcomings e.g.:
- subcontracting
- no possibility to store transport time between operations on
operation level

These normally result in minor customizations.

I worked for Baan Company as a consultant for almost 5 years now. Before that I worked for JDE (2 years) and I had a thorough look at SAP during my study time. I have to say that there is nothing that beats Baan in manufacturing.
Especially with BaanERP5.0c manufacturing and planning which are by their nature the most complex areas are extremely good.
We still fight a few bugs, but overall it has become a very stable product by now.
Besides that I must not forget to mention BaanSCS Scheduler which is a fully integrated add on product for manufacturing scheduling. SCS Scheduler allows operation sequence optimization, planning against limited capacity and consideration of several limiting factors.
Also there is a full integration with the Manufacturing Execution System 'Intrac' of Wonderware (part of the Invensys group). This is available for BaanIV and will soon be available for BaanERP.
No other company in the world offers a functionality in the manufacturing area that can compete with this.

Ravenscross · #7 28th August 2001, 18:40

As with anything, from music to movies, everyone has thier own feelings about everything.

Some people will feel that Baan is awful and complain about it any chance they get (I try to keep away from them at conferences), others love bits or all of Baan.

Depending on where you sit on the fence, developer, user, techie, you will have a different point of view about Baan. I love some of the things I can do with it, plus hate a few things it forces me to do.... However, as has been said in this forum and many others, Baan can be improved and with the benefit of these forums, the required changes can be made. So I'm glad to see that there is a split of 'love & hate' here.

#8 31st August 2001, 18:14

As a general rule, if implementing Baan - absolutely minimize customizations. Change the business before changing Baan. (Of course this also applies to most other packaged software as well). Data capture is a problem with Baan and haven't found a provider that does it really well yet. As one of the posts mentions, their are a couple of packages for shop floor execution that can be "add ons" (SSC being one). Integration is not tight. Also, ECO process is weak in Baan and PDM as an add-on is "ok"- but should be integrated more closely. CAD (Pro-E) interface to PDM is still coming?

Lots of problems/issues around time reporting and labor capture which is intrinsic to efficiency reporting (Baan HRA is a difficult module). Interfacing to HR and Payroll systems is painful. Supply Chain is ok but has some aggravations.

The Baan software suite is huge and moderately buggy. Support has only recently become uniformly "better" for all customers.
Of course, the major hurdle in most implementations is changing the mind-set of users and how they do business. ERP is bigger than they are used to (unless they are converting from SAP) and there is more visibility of data across functional areas. Unless that corporate mindset is changed, implementation of any ERP software is likely to be unsuccessful.

Perhaps the thing I like least in Baan is the security implementation in 4c. Is it any better in 5?

marcel · #9 18th September 2001, 19:40

HI,

BAAN IS A VERY GOOD SYSTEM ......BUT:

HOW TO PROTECT YOUR INVERSION (TIME, PEOPLE FORMATION , $$$$ AND ROI)

DON´T USE BAAN IV VERSION YOU WOULD BE SOON ALONE ON BAAN USER MARKET (INVENSYS ONLY SUPPORT BAAN V)

BE CARE TO CHOSE THE APPROPRIATE MODEL FOR YOUR COMPANY:

MULTI COMPANY OR NOT, SUPPLY CHAIN OR NOT, WORKFLOW(?) AND MANUFACTURING PLANEATION IS VERY IMPORTANT.

BIEN LE BONJOUR
MARCEL

Baanboozeled · #10 19th September 2001, 18:38

Amazing! No support for Baan IV! I think you may have OVERstated that. Baan IV, in one form or another,is running on about 80% of Baan's Client base! Not even the most arrogant of companies would abandon 80% of it's business. ( the brothers have left the building! ha ha )
Most recently, (last week) I received the fastest response from Baan support that I've ever expreienced. Baan IV c3 mcr is the version I am currently supporting.

victor_cleto · #11 20th September 2001, 15:13

Baan is officially comited to support any latest version of Baan for 5 years. If they built version 5 a few months ago, then they will support it for 5 years. It does not mean that they will enhance or fix a lot of bugs, but that means that you can still use it for 5 years more with support.

As Baanboozeled mentioned, Baan IV is the battle horse of the sales within Baan, and I don't see them discarding it for ERP/iBaan without having a certified and fast upgrade path for all the BaanIV customers...

Francesco · #12 5th December 2001, 20:05

I have worked in good and bad Baan environments. Like all (ERP) programs, Baan has its pros and cons.

A major problem with Baan that I think cannot be avoided due to its architecture is the way it handles transactions. When running a large amount of (small) transactions, Baans crappy database management becomes very apparent.

This is a legacy problem that for years has been Baan's albatros. I don't know if they'll ever be able to fix it.

ralmeida · #13 6th December 2001, 14:04

Hi,

In India Baan Has the maximium TRUELY LIVE reference sites..I feel the product is real Value for money and can be implemented very quick if the Top Management want it. Be careful to have a very good D/B admistrator..Most of the problem is not with the Baan package but somewhere else.

Ralmeida

acapulco · #14 8th December 2001, 22:17

Baan is good and reliable.
Our company switched for JDE, at the begining I believed it was a mistake, since the GUI wasn't as nice and Baan's name was going down. But the truth is that Baan does manufacturng and distribution like no one else.

The software is less buggy than JDE OW, and besides a couple of archetectural problems the Functionality is great. We use DEM which I believe is the most powerful tool to create change among end users and Baan data navigator to ease the use of the system to our end users.

If I would haveto choose baan again. I will do it with out blinking.

ulrich.fuchs · #15 13th December 2001, 11:59

Baan is a very good software. However, I would always suggest you go for Baan ERP (Baan V, iBaan, or however they call it next year). It solves some shortcomings that Baan IV always had - especially the segregation between items that you build on order and item that you build anonymously is very strict in Baan IV, and that implies some nasty side effects (you just don't get some information when using those "customized", or on-order-items). For example, cycle counting for those customized items just isn't implemented within Baan IV.

Due to this, I have a slightliy different opinion concerning customizations: I have seen a lot of Baan implementations, and not a single one without customizations. No company is standard, otherwise it would'nt be on market. Baan is standard software. So you will have to make some adjustment to make it perfectly suit your needs. The trick is to make those customizations with as little impact to the standard as possible.

However, and this is a very strong feature in Baan: You can do those customizations very easily (better to say: you consultancy company can do it easily, if it has got clever consultants). Without to much interfering with your update capabilities.

So, when thinking about Baan: Do a functional analysis of your business (What do you need) and put the functionality of Baan against this (Baan won't fit eg. if you're a company earning it's money with renting it's two fisherboats on a lake in Iowa, you get the picture), prepare to change some of your business processes, and prepare to change a little bit of the software.

Don't think that everything just falls from heaven by buying a standard ERP software, in other words: Don't over-expectate (this is true for every out-of-the-box-software, not just for Baan): You don't get better processes / information / cost reduction just by buying a piece of software.

Then the Baan software won't disappoint you, I am very sure about that.

Yours,
Uli